Is it cool to run rich?

[alban]

I saw advertised on the web a kit to solve this SOHC 'hard to get at' stat problem. Someone has confirmed it's an in-hose stat. Don't buy it!
I put the bodge on this site some time ago http://www.mk3oc.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41713 so don't pay extra. May reduce running costs before you get to replace it properly?

All these Astras running cool affects fuel economy as CTS tells ECU to enrich mixture - right? At what coolant temp does it stop doing that? On TopBuzz site the info suggests it's about 80C.
So if it doesn't get that hot it's hurting the pocket and the environment (for all you greenies). Fuel is an expensive commodity these days. The cold weather makes it worse.
My 1.4i runs at about 80C despite new stat and blanked off rad so I reckon lots of guys are driving round cooler than me (yep prob a lot cooler).

 

[Andy_Mk3]

Umm not really. If the stat is stuck open, then the in-hose stat is a suitable fix. Your gauge must be wrong or there must be another problem, most engines run at 90-100C depending on conditions.

 

[Astraguy09]

I saw advertised on the web a kit to solve this SOHC 'hard to get at' stat problem. Someone has confirmed it's an in-hose stat. Don't buy it!
I put the bodge on this site some time ago http://www.mk3oc.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41713 so don't pay extra. May reduce running costs before you get to replace it properly?

All these Astras running cool affects fuel economy as CTS tells ECU to enrich mixture - right? At what coolant temp does it stop doing that? On TopBuzz site the info suggests it's about 80C.
So if it doesn't get that hot it's hurting the pocket and the environment (for all you greenies). Fuel is an expensive commodity these days. The cold weather makes it worse.
My 1.4i runs at about 80C despite new stat and blanked off rad so I reckon lots of guys are driving round cooler than me (yep prob a lot cooler).

Sorry wha?!

Anywho, really a cooler running engine runs more efficiently, not too rich, as the lambda would adjust the fuelling once its warmed up, if its getting to 80 then its fine, the ECU will take info from all of the sensors available, CTS, Lambda etc to get the right fuelling... its better to have something the will get to 80deg as my old Nova used to never leave the blue with the stat stuck open!!

yes its running slightly cooler however not so cold that its going to run rich as hell!!

 

[Mr.Negative]

Mine is an ecotec (x20xev) and is very easy to replace the stat as this is actucally where the top rad hose fits to the engine... however, I had the car running hot so removed the stat and just left the housing and the MPG went down a lot, I then replaced this with a cool running stat and I am now getting what I did MPG wise with the norm stat. The car is also running a lot better and not getting the warm running issues as before.

I recommend a cool running stat on an ecotec motor

 

[Astraguy09]

If its an 8v then you have to take the cambelt off before you can get to the housing, which is why this mod was bought together.

 

[Mr.Negative]

Fair point yes... my stat went on my old 8v after I changed the cambet and it was a new stat so I was annoyed to say the least. Didnt acually think about an "inline" stat but I guess it would appeal to many as I never bothered changing mine due to the effort.

Btw, all I was getting at it I recommend a cool running stat for the X20XEV motor

 

[R1c]

If its an 8v then you have to take the cambelt off before you can get to the housing, which is why this mod was bought together.

i did mine a few weeks ago and it wasn't a hard job and it didn't take long either.
i was out driving again in less than an hour with the temp guage sitting at 90 and having to turn the heaters down because i was getting to hot

 

[astra-cabby]

my 1.4 auto runs cool as hell when i first the car it ran cool so i did the timing belt and replaced the stat and enjoyed the wonderfull world of heaters and only 3k later the bloody car runs cold as hell top hose is same temp as bottom and heater matrix so open stat again, love to know why qh stat only lasted 3k needle never gets outa the blue unless i am in traffic but then as soon as i start moving straight down again

 

[Andy_Mk3]

Was it a genuine or pattern part? Pattern parts can often fail sooner than genuine ones.

 

[astra-cabby]

it was QH part but still thou ya would want more than 3k out of it lol
the ole girl just clicked past 170k on the clocks and still going fine

 

[Astraguy09]

i did mine a few weeks ago and it wasn't a hard job and it didn't take long either.
i was out driving again in less than an hour with the temp guage sitting at 90 and having to turn the heaters down because i was getting to hot

yeah cambelts are the worlds most easy job on an 8v so long as your confident with the spanners and not doing it on a 16 year old engine thats never had it done before however this bodge mod takes about 15mins and all you really need is a screw driver!!

 

[Rusty]

If its an 8v then you have to take the cambelt off before you can get to the housing, which is why this mod was bought together.

Small block 8v that is. Big block ones have the 'stat in a sensible place.

 

[jaye]

like this very much,
bloody running cold is pants as is where the stat is

top man

giong to try blanking off radiator,
any good ideas how, without using cardboard or such thhings
was thinking of some foil over front of vents?

I saw advertised on the web a kit to solve this SOHC 'hard to get at' stat problem. Someone has confirmed it's an in-hose stat. Don't buy it!
I put the bodge on this site some time ago http://www.mk3oc.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41713 so don't pay extra. May reduce running costs before you get to replace it properly?

All these Astras running cool affects fuel economy as CTS tells ECU to enrich mixture - right? At what coolant temp does it stop doing that? On TopBuzz site the info suggests it's about 80C.
So if it doesn't get that hot it's hurting the pocket and the environment (for all you greenies). Fuel is an expensive commodity these days. The cold weather makes it worse.
My 1.4i runs at about 80C despite new stat and blanked off rad so I reckon lots of guys are driving round cooler than me (yep prob a lot cooler).

 

[jaye]

not quite,,, but your nearly there.

IDEALLY an engine runs happily at a specific range, not too hot or too cold.

over cooling defo, is not good for an engine It will use a lot more fuel and it won't be able to burn off the carbon deposits or moisture—which will cause serious maintenance problems in the long term.

Sorry wha?!

Anywho, really a cooler running engine runs more efficiently, not too rich, as the lambda would adjust the fuelling once its warmed up, if its getting to 80 then its fine, the ECU will take info from all of the sensors available, CTS, Lambda etc to get the right fuelling... its better to have something the will get to 80deg as my old Nova used to never leave the blue with the stat stuck open!!

yes its running slightly cooler however not so cold that its going to run rich as hell!!

 

[alban]

The in-hose stat is an easy job but watch the hose doesn't split, don't force it obviously. Haynes says bleed the coolant system by loosening the temp gauge sender on top of the engine block (in the small SOHC models) and run the engine for a while.
Blanking off the rad - I used card from a cornflakes packet wrapped in thick, bin-bag plastic with a foil square stuck on, facing the rad, held by gaffer tape. Rad doesn't get that hot (<80C in my case!). Test the plastic you use by pouring hot kettle water over it first if worried it may melt. Blanked off only 3/4 of rad and left it open at the fan end in case rapid cooling by fan required in slow traffic. Deffo remove in summer months.
Watch your temp for a while.

 

[Lefthooker]

If its an 8v then you have to take the cambelt off before you can get to the housing, which is why this mod was bought together.

unless you have the C20NE 8v with thermo up front ...

 

[Astraguy09]

Yeah rusty said that its in a sensible place on big blocks

 

[tabetha]

I'm sure the german version of the small block had the stat housing in the actual alloy pipe leading from the engine, so easy to do, it's a seriously **** poor design with a belt off to do.
What temp does cold fuel enrichement finish at ?, I'll have a look on my laptop, the vast majority is over by 60C, but a tiny portion remains up till 100C, it is tiny though.
There is I found a massive mismatch between the resistance of the temp sender and the gauge on the mk3 astra, certainly with the C14SE, whose resitance I measured giving massively low readings, but the gauge to go from say mid way to full hot would only be normally around 5-7C difference in actual heat, the ideal temp for power is 76C.
More modern engines have electronic stats, actually a ball valve that opens and closes to cycle between two set points ie say opens at 95C closes at 90C, so temp regualtion is much more precise, and hence fuelling can be maintained within closer limits.
If you buy a WAHLER thermostat you won't have much trouble, I've never had much luck with QH stats, even had some where the central pin came out and jammed the stat open.
tabetha
tabetha

 

[Astraguy09]

Bloody hell tabetha, where have you been hiding?!

Also, it'll be 60, the normal running temp is about 85-90.

 

[tabetha]

I've been busy, put some chav tastic gauges in me cossie now, got some strobes to go on rear of car, I have a phobia about being rear ended, and not in a nice way!!
tabetha